Talk:Castlevania Timeline/Archive 1

Judgment
Does Judgment take place in AD 10000 or 10000 years in the future? Different pages here seem to be giving different answers. --Andrew Nagy 07:25, 6 July 2009 (UTC)

According to the game, Galamoth and the Time Reaper are from 10000 years in the future. Judgment takes place in a different dimension, the Time Rift, where the characters fight, and so the dates are differents : it takes place between Castlevania I and Simon's Quest for Simon and between Dracula's Curse and CoD for Trevor for example. But as it's a cross-over, datation may be unclear. I hope my explanations will help you. -Chernabogue 09:39, 6 July 2009 (UTC)

Bloodletting is 1795?
It is a news never heard of. I'd like to know information origin.--Kiyuhito 15:40, April 26, 2010 (UTC)

Removed.--Kiyuhito

Lords of Shadow contradiction?
According to the official website, the game takes place in 1022. Which one is the mistake?--Evilsbane 21:22, August 15, 2010 (UTC)

Well, if no-one minds, I think the pages which say 1046 should be edited to 1022. Unless there's some sort of proof that 1046 is the correct date?--Evilsbane 12:55, August 16, 2010 (UTC)

Simon's canonical adventure?
Is there any way to determine this? 195.240.198.126 12:36, February 23, 2011 (UTC)


 * Simon's Quest is definitely canonical. As for the "First battle with Dracula", it seems it is Castlevania (original) despite the fact that all product (MSX2, arcade, SNES, X68K) are canon sometimes. -- TX55   TALK  12:52, February 23, 2011 (UTC)

Rumor

 * Originally posted by Nagumo baby on Kiyuhito's talk page

There is a rumor that Cornell from Judgment is from a different universe than the other characters. Have you ever heard of this rumor? Nagumo baby 15:14, January 15, 2012 (UTC)

Possible evidence: Judgment takes place in a "dimensional rift". However, more evidence is needed. Nagumo baby 15:30, January 15, 2012 (UTC)

Although I looked at the Judgment's various rumors (Judgment is: canon, non-canon, parallel universe, Judgment universe, all timeline mixed). But, there is all no sauce and credibility is low. It is the same as the fanfiction and delusion.--Kiyuhito 16:20, January 15, 2012 (UTC)

Me: You mentioned Legend of Cornell was an alternate continuity. Howevef, Cornell appears in Castlevania Judgment, which I believe is not an alternate continuity. How does that work? is he from a different universe than the other characters? It is not really explained in the game itself so I was hoping you could give some clarification on the issue. My apologies for the disturbance.

IGA: "Judgment" is a work that surpasses space and time and brings them together. Without thinking about it too deeply, it has simply been chosen for the character that pervades the series. I don't know if that's the kind of answer you were looking for, but that's about the size of it.

My conclusions:

1.) Judgment is a canonical work that surpasses space and time.

2.) Legend of Cornell is an alternate continuity

3.) Cornell from Judgment is from an alternate reality.

Would you agree? Nagumo baby 18:27, January 16, 2012 (UTC)

Although I approve of this, I think that there will be some persons who do not agree.--Kiyuhito 07:49, January 17, 2012 (UTC)

P.S. Before, Igarashi said by Japanese magazine interview. ''"Mokushiroku" and "Circle of the Moon" is "Gaiden". "Dark Night Prelude" is the "parallel world (parallel universe) which the KCEN staff made".'' He has divided "Gaiden" and "parallel universe". But, I regard both as the same.--Kiyuhito 11:45, January 17, 2012 (UTC)

Yes, that is a bit confusing. I wonder why IGA said that. However, IGA told me the KCEN games were all "parallel world"/ "alternate continuity". He used these words:

"Dark Night Prelude" : parallel world

Mokushiroku" and "Circle of the Moon": alternate continuity

Perhaps there is a difference? Nagumo baby 12:00, January 17, 2012 (UTC)

I think Igarashi probably hates so that he'd like to eliminate Dark Night Prelude. [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q8qJx1LcDmE Koji Igarashi Castlevania Trivia! You Tube] I think it's different in an impression of KCEN game and KCEK game in Igarashi.--Kiyuhito 13:21, January 17, 2012 (UTC)

Kiyuhito, do you know if there is any difference between 別次元 (different dimension) and 別の世界 (different universe/world)? IGA says "Judgment" does not take place in a 別次元 but in a 別の世界. However I don't see any difference. Nagumo baby 14:02, January 23, 2012 (UTC)

別次元 and 別の世界 look the same to me. Probably I think that Igarashi will recognize like this. "別次元 is alternate continuity", "別の世界 is parallel world". I think that Dark Night Prelude and Lords of Shadow are parallel world for Igarashi's timeline.--Kiyuhito 08:14, January 24, 2012 (UTC)

Is there a way to prove that this interpretation is correct? Then we could use it as a reference for the wiki. This is the full sentence:

タイムラインとか別次元とか、そういったものを全く考慮しない、別の世界での出来事だと思っていただければと思います.

Nagumo baby 14:13, January 24, 2012 (UTC)

Igarashi has said that Judgment differs from timeline (probably "Castlevania timeline") and 別次元 (probably "alternate continuity"). Judgment is the world completely different from other Castlevania world.--Kiyuhito 15:22, January 24, 2012 (UTC)

Does the "different world" mean the "non-canon"? or "dimensional rift"? Is Igarashi explaining that Judgment is "canon" or "non-canon"? Or is he explaining the "stage" of Judgment? Igarashi may misunderstand your question.--Kiyuhito 15:40, January 24, 2012 (UTC)

I was wondering the exact same thing. I do not know. I was hoping you might know. IGA is confusing, lol. Let me post the entire conversation. Perhaps it becomes more clear, then.

[me] 悪魔城ドラキュラ黙示録, 悪魔城ドラキュラ黙示録外伝 LEGEND OF CORNELL, 悪魔城ドラキュラ Circle of the Moon, Castlevania: Order of Shadows そして悪魔城ドラキュラ THE ARCADE は、公式の時系列と同じ世界で起きたのですか？

[IGA] 黙示録、黙示録外伝、Circle of the Moon、Order of Shadows、THE ARCADEは、世界観を同じくした別の世界の物語となります. 黙示録、黙示録外伝、Circle of the Moonは、製作者の意図として、そのように扱っております. また、Order of ShadowsとTHE ARCADEは、公式にとらわれると、色々制作がしにくいと思い、外伝で行う方針で最初から進めていったものです.

[me] 最後にもう一つ質問したいことがあります. Legend of Cornellは、相互に関連性があるとおっしゃいましたね. ですが、Cornellは、私が相互に関連はないと考えている悪魔城ドラキュラ ジャッジメントに出ています. この事実はどのように関係しているのでしょうか. 彼は、別の宇宙から来たもう一人の人間なのでしょうか. ゲームの中ではよく 説明されていませんので、この問題についてご説明頂ければ幸いです

[IGA] ジャッジメントは時空も世界も超えて集まる的な作品です. 深い考えは無く、シリーズを通してのキャラクターとして、チョイスされているだけです. ご期待に添う回答か分かりませんが、そんな感じです.

[me] わかりました. ということは、以前の返事で私が提案した考えられる説明が正しいということですか？

[IGA] 正確には考えていないが正しいです. ジャッジメントは、シリーズを通して登場したキャラクター達が、全部の垣根を取り外して、一同に集まったら楽しいなぁ、と考えて生まれた作品です. タイムラインとか別次元とか、そういったものを全く考慮しない、別の世界での出来事だと思っていただければと思います.

Nagumo baby 15:49, January 24, 2012 (UTC)

Thank you, Nagumo baby. I could understand everything. "There is no wall in Judgment". "All-timeline (canon and non-canon) exists in the Judgment". "Mokushiroku, Mokushiroku gaiden, Circle of the Moon, Order of Shadows and THE ARCADE is non-canon".--Kiyuhito 16:24, January 24, 2012 (UTC)

"All-timeline (canon and non-canon) exists in the Judgment". Could you perhaps give me the original Japanese line? I think that confirms my theory. The dimensional rift from Judgment combines all timelines into one world. Nagumo baby 16:32, January 24, 2012 (UTC)

What does "original Japanese line" mean? Latest official timeline (except Ubawareta Kokuin, 1800's) I know is this.--Kiyuhito 16:54, January 24, 2012 (UTC)

You misunderstood me. My apologies. I meant could you give me the quote (格言) of "All-timeline (canon and non-canon) exists in the Judgment". in japanese? Nagumo baby 16:59, January 24, 2012 (UTC)

I understood. Liberal translation is included in "All-timeline (canon and non-canon) exists in the Judgment". "ジャッジメントは時空も世界も超えて集まる的な作品です. " and "ジャッジメントは、シリーズを通して登場したキャラクター達が、全部の垣根を取り外して、一同に集まったら楽しいなぁ、と考えて生まれた作品です. タイムラインとか別次元とか、そういったものを全く考慮しない、別の世界での出来事だと思っていただければと思います. ", I compounded these two.--Kiyuhito 17:40, January 24, 2012 (UTC)

Thank you. What do you think IGA means with "different world". Is it "dimensional rift" or "non-canon"? I do not know. It is frustrating.I asked IGA for clarification but he did not reply yet.

I hope "Judgment" is canon.

Nagumo baby 19:16, January 24, 2012 (UTC)

Igarashi is talking about it, "考えていない (I'm not planning that)". Since Igarashi has not decided the answer, we cannot get the reply beyond this from him. Correct answer itself does not exist.--Kiyuhito 03:20, January 25, 2012 (UTC)

Judgment accepts canon and non-canon. Dimensional rift is located in the different world. Judgement is "別の世界での出来事 (an event in the different world (dimensional rift))". Judgment (dimensional rift/different world) is at the place which isn't the timeline (canon) and alternate dimension (non-canon). Canon game character came from the canon. Non-canon game character came from the non-canon.--Kiyuhito 03:24, January 25, 2012 (UTC)

^If you are 100% sure that interpretation is correct, then we could use that quote from IGA as a reference for the wiki. Nagumo baby 16:02, January 25, 2012 (UTC)

Notes: Liberal translation is included. Is it okay?--Kiyuhito 09:04, January 26, 2012 (UTC)
 * Judgment accepts canon and non-canon: "ジャッジメントは、シリーズを通して登場したキャラクター達が、全部の垣根を取り外して、一同に集まったら楽しいなぁ、と考えて生まれた作品です. "
 * Dimensional rift is located in the different world. Judgement is "別の世界での出来事 (an event in the different world (dimensional rift))". Judgment (dimensional rift/different world) is at the place which isn't the timeline (canon) and alternate dimension (non-canon): "ジャッジメントは、シリーズを通して登場したキャラクター達が、全部の垣根を取り外して、一同に集まったら楽しいなぁ、と考えて生まれた作品です. タイムラインとか別次元とか、そういったものを全く考慮しない、別の世界での出来事だと思っていただければと思います. "
 * Canon game character came from the canon. Non-canon game character came from the non-canon: "ジャッジメントは時空も世界も超えて集まる的な作品です. " and "Judgment Manual-characters -appearances (Simon-CV,CVII:SQ,etc. Carmilla-CVII:SQ,etc. Cornell-CV:LOD. Golem-CV:ROB,etc)"

Yes it is okay. Nagumo baby 13:28, January 26, 2012 (UTC)

That's good to know. By the way, Did Igarashi tell about any Akumajo Dracula XX? Was that Gaiden(non-canon/alternate continuity)?--Kiyuhito 13:43, January 26, 2012 (UTC)

Yes, he told me this:

Akumajo Dracula XX = alternate continuity

Akumajo Dracula X = canon

Dracula Densetsu Rebirth = alternate continuity

Dracula Densetsu = canon

Akumajo Dracula (MSX)/(SFC)/(AC) = alternate continuity

Akumajo Dracula (FC/X68000) = canon

FC version and X68000 version are the same story but with a different middle part. Nagumo baby 13:58, January 26, 2012 (UTC)

Thanks, "Akumajo Dracula X" is "Rondo of Blood"?--Kiyuhito 14:04, January 26, 2012 (UTC)

Yes. Nagumo baby 14:08, January 26, 2012 (UTC)

Thank you very much.--Kiyuhito 14:09, January 26, 2012 (UTC)

Do you think when IGA says "gaiden" he means "alternate timeline" (http://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E6%AD%B4%E5%8F%B2%E6%94%B9%E5%A4%89SF). For example: LEGEND OF CORNELL-->黙示録 / 血の輪廻-->月下の夜想曲 \                      奪われた刻印-->バンパイアキラー-->ギャラリー オブ ラビリンス Nagumo baby

I have seen this timeline by the KCEK homepage. 血の輪廻(1792)-->月下の夜想曲(1797)-->LEGEND OF CORNELL(1844)-->黙示録(1852)-->Quincy Morris(1897)-->バンパイアキラー(1917) For KCEK, this is canon. But for Igarashi, this is gaiden/alternate timeline (Although Igarashi has said that this is the KCEK staff's intention, I do not trust it).--Kiyuhito 03:40, February 3, 2012 (UTC)

From what year was that timeline? Was it from before 2000? Because in this timeline from 2000 黙示録 and LEGEND OF CORNELL are already treated as gaiden/alternate timeline. Nagumo baby 13:42, February 3, 2012 (UTC)

KCEK's timeline from July, 2000. It is written to this magazine (Dengeki-scoop2.jpg, It was probably issued at the end of 2000) in this way. 1830年 ネイサン・グレーブス 来年発売予定のGBA「悪魔城ドラキュラ サークルオブザムーン」で登場. 「ドラキュラ」の正統な歴史とどう関わってくるかはまだ不明. 制作はKCE神戸.

1852年 ラインハルト・シュナイダー キャリー・ヴェルナンデス N64版「悪魔城ドラキュラ黙示録」(写真)などで活躍. 「ネイサンとシュナイダーたちについては、きちんと調査してから扱いを決めたいです. みなさんの意見を聞いてみたいですね」(IGA氏) Those days, the treatment of the timeline was both undecided.--Kiyuhito 14:08, February 3, 2012 (UTC)

What does it say in the column above the "Dark Night Prelude" column? Nagumo baby 15:35, February 3, 2012 (UTC)

It is written 1400年代 ソニア・ベルモンド GB「悪魔城ドラキュラ 漆黒たる前奏曲」で活躍. 正統なドラキュラの話とは無関係のアナザーワールド的な物語として存在. ソニア・ベルモンドという女性とドラキュラの息子アルカードの愛が描かれる. "Unrelated another world story".--Kiyuhito 16:34, February 3, 2012 (UTC)

Found an old timeline
I found an old offical timeline from 2000. Is this the timeline from the KCEK offical website?


 * Yes, I am keeping the copy of KCEK's Akumajo Dracula series official site.--Kiyuhito 01:24, April 16, 2012 (UTC)

Since I know this time line, I doubt of Igarashi's remark (Mokushiroku and Legend of Cornell is gaiden. KCEK staff's intention). From which KCEK staff did Igarashi hear it? Yuji Shibata? Etsunobu Ebisu? Takeo Yakushiji?--Kiyuhito 16:53, April 21, 2012 (UTC)

And, I got this timeline (Dengeki Nintendo 64, 1999). "1400's: Sonia Belmondo's era -> 1476: Ralph C. Belmondo's era -> 1576/1591: Christopher Belmondo's era -> 1691/1698: Simon Belmondo's era -> 1792/1797: Richter Belmondo's era -> 1897/1917: Johnny Morris's era -> And, Reinhardt's battle begins..."--Kiyuhito 17:13, April 21, 2012 (UTC)

This is a confusing matter. This is my theory:

IGA: (about Circle of the Moon, Mokushiroku, and Legend of Cornell) These games were taken out of the timeline, not because I didn't work on them, but because they were considered by their directors to be side projects in the series, especially Legacy of Darkness and Circle of the Moon

I think original intention of Mokushiroku was that it was supposed to be in continuity. However, they changed their minds when they released their Mokushiroku "update" Legend of Cornell. They added gaiden to the title of the game. I suspect the reason was because Mokushiroku conflicted with Vampire Killer (in Mokushiroku the Schneider family has the holy whip, in Vampire Killer the Morris family has it).

However, this does not explain the timeline from the KCEK website. Nagumo baby 08:57, April 22, 2012 (UTC)


 * My speculation: KCEK website timeline ignores canon and non-canon. --Nagumo baby (talk) 13:03, July 15, 2012 (UTC)


 * A certain meaning and its guess are right. Before Igarashi's Castlevania Chronicles, nobody classified an "Canon, Non-canon".--Kiyuhito (talk) 15:14, July 15, 2012 (UTC)

My speculation: "Mokushiroku Gaiden" is "Mokushiroku's prequel". "gaiden" has a meaning called "prequel". It agrees with the story of the game. I think that Igarashi deleted the timeline by his intention. (I have not said that it is a wrongdoing. Administration person often performs it) Malus overlaps with Soma. And, Circle of the Moon is gaiden has source in the Konami magazine.--Kiyuhito 16:08, April 22, 2012 (UTC)

This is unrelated to what we previously discussed. Does the timeline from Dengeki Nintendo 64 also mention Boku Dracula-Kun? I think it's mentioned in a little section underneath it, but I'm not sure. Nagumo baby 15:57, May 4, 2012 (UTC)

Nope. Dracula-kun does not exist in Dengeki Nintendo 64, 1999 vol2 timeline. Dracula-kun exists only in 1997 (Gekka no Yasōkyoku's secret) timeline.--Kiyuhito 02:00, May 5, 2012 (UTC)

Where is the proof that Lords of Shadow takes place in a seperate timeline?
I'd just like to know why there is no citation showing proof that Lords of Shadow is OFFICIALLY a seperate timeline from the rest of the series, proof from konami?

Or is it just another wild theory written as fact?

how do you know it's not the first game in the series?--121.219.59.78


 * David Cox, Lords of Shadow's producer, twitted about it and confirmed it several times. -Chernabogue 14:35, June 3, 2012 (UTC)


 * This.--Kiyuhito 14:44, June 3, 2012 (UTC)


 * Original poster here.. sorry, i'm a complete newb at wiki stuff
 * but uh
 * wow damn, that disappoints me :( i was really getting into castlevania, i played the first 2 when i was a young child and then brought Harmony of Despair about a year ago, then dawn of sorrow, portrait of ruin and order of ecclesia a few months after and played through them.
 * I hope they redo the storyline with the same characters at least..--121.219.59.78