Talk: Lenore

Lenore's Suicide

I can't help but wonder to what extent Lenore's ultimate suicide was motivated not entirely by unhappiness as Isaac's captive, but by a realization of how much the world would change, and not in vampire-kind's favor. Obviously the former is the more obvious explanation, but the latter feels interesting given Lenore's deeper worries about change and power. With the fall of primary vampiric kingdoms, nothing now stands in the way of humanity's rapid ascent in technological and military power starting in the early modern era. Already, the human Ottoman Empire had demonstrated gunpowder's terrifying potential in the fall of Constantinople, and soon pikes and swords would give way to arquebuses and then musket, against which supernatural vampire strength means far less. Field artillery, naval warfare, and sheer strength in humanity's numbers would grow in importance by the day, and ultimately we know, mankind would develop armaments capable of incinerating entire cities and armored war machines that make Hector's night creatures seem gentle by comparison.

All of this was to come of course, historically, and we don't know to what extent Lenore could foresee the scale of the long term sea change. But for a change-averse being who is already wondering what place a vampire like her has in the world, any inklings must have surely weighed on her. Who better than her, after all, would foresee a victorious mankind's limited capacity for mercy towards other beings who challenge its growing dominion? Somnophyle (talk) 15:42, 19 May 2021 (UTC)

I don't really buy into the motivation they gave her. As a diplomat, Lenore was the best person to work on ways for vampires and humans to coexist in peace (something that Lisa also always wanted). I also would guess it's a goal that redeemed Isaac could support as well. So on the contrary, she had all the motivation to live and do the work she actually enjoys - making peace. Instead authors wrote her off giving Lenore and existential crisis she didn't deserve as a character at all. — Gilrond (talk) 15:53, 19 May 2021 (UTC)

You raise great points. I think the reason that they decided to off Lenore was a bit of the redemption=death trope, but also staying in line with Castlevania as a franchise's broader disinterest in the notion of wide-spread, perpetual peace and coexistence, only zero-sum antagonism. (The game is basically about you killing countless vampires and ilk to safeguard mankind's interests!)

Still, I wish Lenore realized that the same concern about how vampire's interact with humans would cut both ways if the tables were ever turned. If I had the chance to re-write the suicide decision, then Hector, instead of simply demurring to Lenore's existential despair, give one of those cliche passionate speeches about how her people need her diplomatic skills more than ever in the face of an ascendant humanity. That coexistence is a two-way street, and securing peace was now more important than ever for vampiric survival. Somnophyle (talk) 17:16, 19 May 2021 (UTC)

I think they were doing a good job at avoiding games tropes of "vampires are all evil" or "the only redemption is death". Until they killed Lenore that is. That was also weird in the face of bringing Vlad back all redeemed and happy after his crazy revenge rampage, while Lenore who cared about happiness and not about power got such an unhappy ending. It just didn't feel fair for her character at all.

I sure hope in any potential sequels they'll have vampire characters like Lenore who don't want conflict and want to coexist with humans in peace. — Gilrond (talk) 17:28, 19 May 2021 (UTC)

If the producer absolutely had to kill off Lenore for whatever reason, I think a more thematically fitting for Lenore to have been talked out of suicide, discovered that she was pregnant from Hector, and then die from childbirth complications after giving birth to a healthy Dhampir girl. Cheesy perhaps, but at least in her final moments, she would have been able to hold a baby that symbolizes the possibility of lasting human vampire peace. To top it off, they could even have her funeral consist of her body being exposed to sunlight and disintegrating, fulfilling in a way her stated desire to see the sunrise.

I know, I know, it's cheesy. But better than the suicide ending.Somnophyle (talk) 18:09, 19 May 2021 (UTC)

Yeah Lenore having a child with Hector would have been a great finale, and not killing her at all with that even better. — 18:32, 19 May 2021 (UTC)